[00:03:28] Host: Before that, do you have an estimate of how much land the Cahuilla tribe recognized?

[00:03:37] Gerald: We do have a cultural uses map. You got to understand the borders, unless it's a wall. Borders ebbed and flowed with the generations. Cahuilla territory went from a present day where I'm at right now, Riverside, California, maybe even as far west as Corona. It went all the way back through Riverside County, Northern San Diego County, Southern San Bernardino County, and was around the Salton Sea and going out towards the Colorado River. There are several different bands of the Cahuilla people today. Some of those are up in the mountains, and that's where my band is.

Some are down in the Coachella Valley. If you're familiar with the Morongo band of Cahuilla Indians, they're there in the pass area just east of Banning. Those are all portions of our traditional cultural use area. I used to teach in Oklahoma. Some of my students there, they were Seminoles. They were from Florida, their people were from Florida who were sent eastward, just like the Cherokee of the Trail of Tears, the five civilized tribes were sent to Oklahoma. Those people, they’re thousands of miles away from their traditional homeland. Even though the Cahuilla, we have a small, small portion of land that we originally held, at least we are still in our traditional homeland. I feel very blessed. As a professor at UCR, I feel very blessed that I can be a Cahuilla Indian man, and I can teach what I teach in our traditional homelands.

[00:05:25] Host: I'm coming from a place of ignorance. I admit this, it's disappointing to admit this, but out of the 110 federally recognized tribes in California, I think I could probably name five. Three of those, I just learned in the last five years. That's a shame. I was born and raised in California, grew up in Northern California, spent most of my life down here. That's a shame. I think it's a fault in our educational system. I think it exists nationally, that this rich history of our native people is relegated to a week's conversation, if that, a page and a history book, if that. Until that changes, I don't think that we're going to-- We're on an uphill battle. I don't know what your thoughts are on that.

[00:06:21] Gerald: I think one of the major changes that needs to happen is that America, mainstream America needs to understand that Native American history in this country is American history. Oftentimes when you take an American history class, it starts with the Revolution or the colonists, or what have you. Indeed, I was asked here at UCR, I was asked to teach a class called California Indian History. The description of the class, it was probably written in the '70s, was the rich history and heritage of California Indians, from Spanish contact to the 20th century. I run that by my students. They all think it's perfect, and I'm like, no. I said, native people have been here for thousands of years before the Europeans stumbled into the Western Hemisphere, and we're still here in the 21st century.

Classes like that, and the teachers that you had, the teachers that I've had, they had the same lackluster education that we were given as well. It's this idea that a class like that, it was really about European impact on California Indians. It wasn't about California Indian cultures. Until we realize that the history of the indigenous people of the lands that we now call California, that's California history, that's American history and we need to teach it that way and we need to value it that way, then maybe it becomes part of the dialogue of the classroom when we're discussing the history of these lands.

[00:08:06] Host: Well then I'm wondering how much of that history has already been lost. A lot of these languages are dying languages. As these native languages disappear from our tongues and our mouths, and our ears, that history disappears as well.

[00:08:26] Gerald: Had the gold rush happened here in Southern California, I wouldn't even be here, my people wouldn't be here, that was devastating. That being said, the story of native people in this hemisphere, the story of my people is a story of resilience. We teach that when we think about the pioneers coming across the westward expansion, and pull yourself up by your bootstrap, and all those kinds of things, but we don't do that when we do native culture. It's certainly challenging.

I will say, I've learned some things about my people's own history from non-native people. I don't apologize for that. I don't think that's a weakness because thank God someone took interest enough to document this stuff because we've been in survival mode for a couple centuries now. I think a lot of the knowledge, maybe not all of it, but I think a lot of the knowledge and the stories, whether they be in the form of a written history or documented through art and images, or through song and through story, and like many times native creation stories, those are our belief system. You go to a bookstore, and you'll find the Bible, you'll find the Koran. Then you'll find books called The Myths and Legends of the American Indian. I was like, okay, our stories are myths and legends, and your stories are the-- You see. I think it's out there, but we have to change our attitude toward those things. Creation stories, they're the blueprint of how a community can survive and live within a specific environment, but instead, we turn them into fairy tales and they're not taken seriously.

This is what I do in my classes. I try to open students eyes to them, the fact that there's some real important, and what I call the indigenous intellectual tradition, which is often stereotyped as being superstitious or quaint fairy tale-like, humorous. There's some real knowledge there. I think what's important about what I do as an educator is there's some answers in indigenous intellectual traditions that could solve some of the most important issues that globally we face as a species, if people will just bother looking and taking it seriously.

[00:11:21] Host: In 2003, you came back to take over your family's ranch, you said 400 acres about that.

[00:11:30] Gerald: Yes, roughly.

[00:11:32] Host: What was the pressure, or was there any pressure to return, or was it already understood that this is what you were going to do? Where were you before that? You were in Oklahoma at that point?

[00:11:44] Gerald: Yes, I was teaching at a regional university in Oklahoma. Both my daughters were born in Oklahoma. It was just understood. My dad was the only son. He had three sisters. Then I was the only son. It was just assumed. I don't want to paint it as though that typical story of pressure on the kids to do this or do that. I was happy to do it, and I just always understood that that was the way it was going to be.

[00:12:13] Host: Was part of that returning to your land, not just your family's land, but your people's land as well?

[00:12:21] Gerald: Yes, absolutely. I will say when my dad was alive, it was actually-- I don't want to speak for my sister, but I think she has similar thoughts. He was an alcoholic, and so was his dad, and I have that potential in me as well. It was hard for us to live here with him like that. I don't want your listeners to think, this typical story of alcoholism in tribal communities, without also considering the intergenerational trauma that was inflicted on our people.

My grandparents met in Federal Indian Boarding School. They were raised more by these, in some cases, sadistic teachers. They were raised more by them than they were their own parents. As a parent myself, I can't even fathom the tragedy of being told I was incompetent and incapable of raising my own kids. Those traumas continue on to this day. That's a real solid reason why I didn't live here at that time.

[00:13:26] Host: Now we got to talk about time management. You came back, you're taking care of a lot of property and a pretty good amount of cattle. You're also a professor of ethnic studies at UC, Riverside, as you mentioned, and you're also a full-time artist. What does time management look like?

[00:13:48] Gerald: [laughs] Thanks for bringing that up, because yes, I've got a lot of irons in the fire sometimes, literally.

[00:13:55] Host: Right, yes. [laughs]

[00:13:57] Gerald: I'm teaching today. I teach all day today and then I'll probably be in the studio this evening. I've got a big work I'm working on. Then I just talked to my brother-in-law a little while ago, and the cows got out while I was in class, and pushed down the fence, and so we're going to be fencing some this weekend. Then there's also tomorrow's California Indian Day. September 23rd is California Indian Day here in California. I'm going be singing and dancing over at a celebration at Cal State San Bernardino, Friday.

Then there's a cultural gathering at the Morongo Reservation all weekend. I'll probably be singing and dancing there on Sunday. There was a documentary that a filmmaker made about my return to the reservation way back in 2005, I think, is when it came out. It wasn't just me, but he also interviewed, the filmmaker, interviewed a couple elders. One of the elders, and it stuck with me and still with me. He said the person that's a Cahuilla is the person that makes the decision to be Cahuilla. When I go and sing and dance, or I teach about our culture, or I go gather plants with my daughters, whatever, it's not extra that I've added to my life. No, this is my life. Art is my life, teaching is my life, the ranching too. Actually, the ranching and the art compliment what I do as an academic, and the academia compliments what I do in the ranching and in the art. It all cross-pollinates.

Another elder told me the reason why the creator gave us five digits on our hand is that we shouldn't be working towards one goal or be one person at any time. That's the story of mainstream America, the person who dedicated themselves solely to this one endeavor and have become a champion or whatever. Again, that's another kind of belief system that's very foreign to me. I'm talking to you right now as an academic and as a native person, but also as a father and as a rancher, and an artist. Sometimes people say people like myself live in two worlds and I'm like, man, I wish that were true. I live in about 15 different worlds, I'm just code-switching left and right and doing what I do, but that's my life. That's how I live it.

[00:16:28] Host: I'd love to talk a little bit about your artwork. You have two pieces that were just brought into the Escalette Permanent Collection at Chapman University. Your pieces tend to have a statement to them. There is messaging in your art. I'm curious how much of your work is determining that message, and then how much of the work is just doing and making, and then realizing there's something behind it, inspiring it?

[00:16:59] Gerald: That's a good question. I have something to say. When I was in graduate school, I dabbled with some abstract painting and such, and I actually enjoy making that. I did not enjoy when people would look at the work and interpret it in all these different ways that I never necessarily meant. I have something to say. I always say I'm less of a poet and more of a documentarian in that I'm pretty straightforward with my messages. I feel like I am. That doesn't mean that I'm closed off to ideas because sometimes I'll make something with a specific intent and then I'll hear somebody interpret something.

Because we all have our positionality. We bring our experiences to the work, then I'll look at the work and I'm like, yes, I see that and I like that. Just because I make the work doesn't mean I don't learn from it. That's a myth that people don't know, or they think that I'm the creator, so I know it all. I certainly don't. I'm open to ideas and suggestions outside of myself, because that's what makes it interesting for me. Art students, they're told that you have a sketchbook and you should be working in your sketchbook. I don't sketch much at all.

My sketchbook is more like lists. If I have an idea, I start making a list. It might be a list, like, if I have an idea, what kind of materials would best convey that idea? Then I would do a list. What colors or textures, or shapes would best express those? I make a bunch of lists. Then I connect these words and these concepts. Then that's when I get started with the-- Then I might do a sketch of, this is what it might look like. You make a sketch or whatever. When I was younger I always thought, when I'm really good as an artist, I'll do a sketch, and then I'll do the work and it'll look just like it. Now, I've come to realize that's a complete myth, that that'll never happen.

[00:19:10] Host: It's like the artist trying to capture the image in the brain. You will never be able to create what your mind sees or what your mind hears.

[00:19:19] Gerald: That's always been my thought on when you read a book and you love a book, and then they make a movie of it. You never like the movie because that movie, that film, no matter what CGI they're using, they could never match the brilliance, the images that you put onto those words while you were reading that book.

[00:19:41] Host: I'd love to talk a little bit about the commodification of art and commodification of "native art" as well. I think any artist who is out to make money is already doomed to fail. If that is your goal, then you will not succeed. That's in any art form. When looking at native art or traditional native art. To me, it feels like it's beautifully crafted functional items that tourists buy and hang on their wall. It seems like, traditionally and historically, that it was not making pieces to sell, it was making things to use. Am I correct in thinking that?

[00:20:28] Gerald: I think you're on the right track. Many, many Americans today, they have their dishes up in the cupboard in their kitchens that were purchased. They were mass produced in some factory somewhere in the world, and then they're purchased through some kind of retailer, and they're functional, they're completely functional, but it's hard to say that they enhance our daily lives by interacting with them, or what have you. By making things that are used on a daily basis that are functional, but also add to the aesthetic quality of one's life, I think is hugely important, and I think the native people understood that.

I went to a conference years ago back in the '90s, it was a native art conference. The concept or the theme was, we have no word for art. I understand the concept that they were saying, but I don't think that's necessarily true. We understood aesthetics, we understood when something was very well made, and it's pleasing. I know myself, in my studio back when I first got going, I had all the cheapest tools. They were not a joy to work with. Now that I'm older, I saved up my pennies or asked for a Christmas gift or whatever, and now I got better tools, and they're a joy to work with. It's a similar kind of thing.

It enhances one's life and the energy it brings to whatever you happen to be doing. Sadly, we replace that. Contemporary America has replaced that with mass-produced cheaper anonymous. Even the Cahuilla people and tribes here in California, we're known for this really, really high-quality basket making. Think about basket making, when someone finds out-- I remember when I was an undergraduate, someone said, "You're in college. What do you major in?" I would say, "Art," and then they would, "Oh," and then say, "What are you taking, basket weaving?"

[00:22:38] Host: Basket weaving is the joke. [laughs]

[00:22:39] Gerald: Yes. It's like this joke. Yet here we have this very, very fine art. You think about basket weaving, again, it's a gendered art, so it was done primarily by women, but these women, they knew the plants that they used to create the baskets, so they were like botanists. They knew where they grew, they knew how they grew, they knew how to perpetuate growth, and they knew how to harvest without harming the plants, so they were like botanists.

Then when they bring those materials home, they treat those materials however they need to do, whether it's dyeing the color, whether it's splitting it, or whatever. They would combine it. Then what they would do is they would add these designs that referred to our belief system, our cosmology. They were philosophers, too. They were scientists. It's truly amazing. I think the story of this complexity of basket weaving, and the joke of basket weaving, that shows you how far apart our cultures are.

[00:23:42] Host: How important is the commodification of these items, whether they're the baskets or pottery in some places, or woven blankets? How important is the sale of those to the community, to the tribe?

[00:24:00] Gerald: The Santa Fe Indian market, which happens, I think it's the third weekend of August every year, it's the biggest Indian market here in the United States that happens annually. I don't participate in Indian market. I know a lot of people who do. I've characterized it as the largest exportation of our creative endeavors out of the communities. It's usually non-natives who come and who buy these things that no longer are part of our culture. They've left.

Now, that being said, and I'm an academic, that being said, as a native artist, we can get real idealized. We can say, this isn't right and blah, blah, blah, but as a native artist, it's nice to be able to eat and pay your rent. That's the reality. It's easy for me to judge. I got this academic job so I don't have to sell. That's why I've taught all these years, is because it's freed me from the commercial market. To be honest with you, I haven't had a whole lot of luck over the years selling what I do. If I'm talking about genocide, nobody wants genocide hanging over their couch.

[00:25:24] Host: [laughs] Put this in the hallway.

[00:25:28] Gerald: Exactly, in the foyer. I've had more luck with university galleries, with nonprofit spaces, with museums because that emphasis is not simply on selling, it's all about learning. It's about cultural interaction.

[00:25:48] Host: If you're okay with this, you talked about the importance of song and art in maintaining this history, and you participate in bird singing, which is singing your people's history. Would you be able to give us a little bit of that?

[00:26:07] Gerald: One example, I don't have my rattle with me here, but one example that people oftentimes are surprised at is we have a series of songs about earthquakes. We think of earthquakes in a scientific seismic kind of way. Of course we have songs about earthquakes. We're California Indians.These songs, they're our history, and they tell the story of our early migration and the creation. It makes complete sense that we would have these types of songs. These songs help us remember the teachings that were handed down generation from generation.

There's another one talking about the pack rat who's going in and out of their den carrying supplies or whatever, because they're getting ready for winter. Why do we sing about the pack rat? Because it's a story. It's telling us that you've got to be prepared. Our creation story, unlike maybe the Christian creation story, our creation story starts with two miscarriages. Then the third one is when finally the creators are born. I think people are surprised to hear about a miscarriage at the beginning of time, but I think what that sets forward for the queer people is that life is hard.

From the very beginning, life has been hard. Creation was hard. It sets the tone for that's what we need to prepare, we need to expect. The song about the pack rat, preparing for winter, that's telling ourselves, that's telling our youth that you have to be prepared. Think about the United States when COVID hit. We were so unprepared. A lot of the PPE, the face masks were made in other countries. We weren't even making them here. There's that message, there's that lesson.

[00:28:03] Host: I'm going to finish here, I think this is an interesting question, and especially as I ask it to different people from different cultures and different backgrounds. I'd love to know, what does the American dream look like to you, or what does it make you feel when you hear that term mentioned?

[00:28:24] Gerald: I think it's very narrow. That story, the story of America, the great melting pot, the American dream, all those things. I tell my students, we were all catfished in thinking that that was for everyone, because it certainly isn't. I also think that there are various versions of what that ideal is. I had my very first class for the quarter today, and my students asked if we were going to have class on Thanksgiving because they assumed that I didn't celebrate Thanksgiving and I would show up for class or what have you.

I laughed. I told them, "I love eating a lot and then watching the cowboys lose." That's like a great thing for a native person to do. The American dream for me, so much of it's tied to the land. I see so much abuse to the land. Again, there are lessons in this indigenous intellectual tradition that I'd like to see mainstream America look at seriously, like the California wildfires, we have answers for that.

You're starting to see some articles, LA Times, The Huffington Post about Cal Fire and state officials looking at that history of controlled burns and cultural burns. It's really just lip service right now because we have no word for nature or the wilderness. This idea of natural resources, that's foreign to us as well because the world is not just meant to be used, to be extracted from. I guess for me, the American dream is where we're all on the same page working towards making the world a better place, not just extracting from it.

[00:30:29] Host: If you would like to continue the conversation, visit chapman.edu/wilkinson to hear all of the lectures from this series. To access recommended books from our guests for further learning and for more socially conscious content, visit us at pastforward.org, or follow us at Apple, Spotify, or wherever you podcast.